For me one wall in this gallery does not seem to fit in with the light hearted theme. This week, we pivot from psychology and politics to religion and history as we explore how people have tried to resolve these fears. So I sat at a table where a couple of girls were, and I just sat there. I watched this over and over. Listen Now. And so that was pretty much the rest of the day. This article has been rated as start-Class. Plus, a girl who comes up with her own one-woman integration plan. You have to break that up. Nikole Hannah-Jones' story on the Normandy school district from the first part of the show continues. That is the overall score for the entire country. I mean, like, never. Support Norman Rockwell Museum and share the Legacy of Norman Rockwell's Art. I'm Ira Glass. Nikole Hannah Jones. If you can improve it, please do. Can you guess? I felt like somebody was stabbing me in my back. We're carrying over routines and patterns we adjusted to in 2020 that we thought were only temporary. I stumbled on this place by accident. We're carrying over routines and patterns we adjusted to in 2020 that we thought were only temporary. People tried us almost every day. So I had to walk out, go to the big gym. Nedra, who had taken off of work to come, was watching from the side. People Want to Read. And it's not even on the table. It hasn't been done. We were non-accredited. I was like, "What? So it's not even like they're getting the same quality teachers as kids who are advanced. Driving up I could see the crowd, but living in New Orleans, I actually thought it was Mardi Gras. Research help today from Michelle Harris. Rockwell's first assignment for Look magazine was an illustration of a six-year-old African-American school girl being escorted by four U.S. marshals to her first day at an all-white school in New Orleans. Though Normandy officials deny that's why they chose Francis Howell. St. Louis school districts finally desegregated Dec 3, 1999. 3. This week: a city going all-out to integrate its schools. I don't care about everything else that falls by the wayside, because it will, two to three years when we all move out of the district. You have no choice, like me. 00:02 Fullscreen . I literally, mentally, had a vision of a herd of cattle being pushed on a truck, being herded back to where they came from. And I find this one thing that really worked, that cut the achievement gap between black and white students by half. I didn't even get halfway to the microphone because of what the parents were saying. Through out all of my podcast, childhood messages will be discussed as the key ingredient towards healthy adulthood. Most black kids will not be shot by the police but many of them will go to a school like Michael Brown's. We're just stuck there because we're not open to the opportunities. Investigating school segregation in 2018 with Nikole Hannah-Jones: podcast & transcript. SPIEGEL: So today, we begin with the story of one woman who went searching for a solution to a problem that ultimately she found, in a way. Francis Howell is no longer accepting any students from the Normandy because Normandy is now called the Collaborative something. Most Recent Podcast 4 Rhythms to Renew Your Mind. But even there, they were just improving the students' scores. And that's what I really began to look at. It's the kids. And the problem is, we’re stuck with one other. The first person that I met at Francis Howell was Brittany. What does that mean?" Thoughts on “The Problem We All Live With” By Tech Powered Dad | August 11, 2015 As the the one year anniversary of Michael Brown shooting in Ferguson, MO, This American Life has completed a very thought provoking two part series on the state of school desegregation both in the St. Louis area specifically and the United States as a whole. It didn't go so well. What you're saying is, small, incremental progress. I knew why they did that. Our program today, The Problem We All Live With. Every last one of them. Period: Dec 3, 1971 to Dec 4, 1988. She was one of the students who was bussed out of St. Louis when she was a kid. I love her. Here is what the last few months at Normandy Middle School have been like. We don't have to like it, and we don't have to make it easy. The problem is that because this seems to be so contagious, it means that overall, … Our program was produced today by Chana Joffe-Walt and Jonathan Menjivar with Zoe Chase, Sean Cole, Stephanie Foo, Miki Meek, Robyn Semien, Alissa Shipp, and Nancy Updike, editing help from Joel Lovell. So a week after the announcement that Normandy would bus kids to Francis Howell, officials there held a town meeting to talk about it. If you are able, we strongly encourage you to listen to the audio, which includes emotion and emphasis that's not on the page. CHARLES PEARSON: I think, well, the first indicators of a turnaround is if within three years, at the end of our third year, all of our schools will be accredited again. WNYC Studios is leading the new golden age in audio with high quality storytelling that informs, inspires and delights millions of curious and highly engaged listeners. And they wanted to make sure the new students felt welcomed. Each year, the Missouri Department of Elementary and Secondary Education puts out a report that shows how each of its 520 school districts is doing. It's not that suddenly a switch turns on and they get intelligence or wanting the desire to learn when they're with white kids. So you're right. And I was like, "Hi, I'm Mah'Ria." That's supposed to be like a warning. It's made up of one high school, the one that Michael Brown attended, a middle school, and five elementary schools. And for the most part, it worked. We're still dealing with that today. We would have been so close to eliminating it. The law says they can't keep the Normandy kids in schools that aren't accredited. A Pandemic Update: The Variant and the Vaccine Rollout With the coronavirus at a peak in the United States, we look at the latest in the fight against the disease. The war was a civil war, the first of two in Liberia, West Africa. So they're proposing charter schools and virtual school programs that students would attend. And she was trying to fight me over nothing. Or even how to generate more sales? But her first big reporting job was back in 2003. We've given you a new name. And I want that security before my children walk into Francis Howell. Don't miss an episode of Houston We Have A Problem. And I think I'm so obsessed with this because we have this thing that we know works, that the data shows works, that we know is best for kids. But race barely comes up that night, except when white parents insist it is not the issue. Now and then, one of them jumped in. They put their kids on the bus to go integrate the schools, and they followed behind because they needed to make sure their kids were OK. Yeah. Nikole says that her parents sent her and her sister to a school across town, which was all white, except for five black kids, which included the two of them. So I'm hoping that their discipline records come with them, like their health records come with them. And so today, we thought we would put it on the table and talk about it. That's it. But I didn't really understand until I started covering education that we were part of a desegregation program. Play free podcast episodes on-demand with iHeartRadio. 00:02. If Normandy folded, all of its students, an additional 3,000 of them, would have to be absorbed into other school districts. No one got stabbed. OK? St. Louis Public Radio recorded the meeting. Right. Make them ride a long distance to school every day. How are you going to feel? Cameron and other students finished in five minutes. And she's written this amazing article-- I cannot recommend this highly enough-- about choosing a school for her own kid in New York City's segregated school system. Meanwhile, the same year, the mostly black Normandy District that had lost its accreditation, was still operating, though barely. If you're just tuning in, we're telling the story of the Normandy School District that Michael Brown graduated from. The Problem We All Live With, 1964. Nedra found herself pleading for an exception. You know, he finally explained to me why he showed up at work wearing hiking boots and a suit covered in dirt. Because I felt that I needed to represent what if your kid was in a Normandy high school and they were just offered this opportunity, and other parents are saying "We don't want you here." Which Nikole has heard before. But integration-- before I talked to Nikole about this, I had this vague sense about integration-- maybe you had this too-- that we tried that. Any student in Normandy was now allowed out. And I want-- this is what I want. And my question is that, what are we doing as far as helping with the transition of these students coming into Normandy? And eventually, a judge sided with the parents. I still have it to this day-- Francis Howell Volleyball Camp. Mah'Ria looked around, surveying the gym-- a sea of 3,000 mostly white faces. I didn't expect to make a friend that fast, because I remember I think it was after my third or fourth hour, I had went to lunch. Again, Francis Howell did not respond to requests to talk to us. When the state took over, it fired all the teachers over the summer. Nedra said teachers did not seem to care. We're going to improve teacher quality. Pretty fast.". This is how far they will go to avoid that one thing, that one thing that already seems to be working-- integration. They began calling kids up, one by one, to get their certificates. And even things that should have been good news turned to bad news. Maybe Michael Brown's mom knew these scores. Tell me what does turning around Normandy look like. It was a small thing, but for Nedra and Mah'Ria, it was the last straw. Francis Howell was 85% white. I know from my own life, and now being able to look at the longitudinal data on it, realizing that, yes, I am living the life that that data says you live when you have the opportunity to go to an integrated school. When I asked Nikole if that was fast, she was all like, "Well, black people first arrived on this continent as slaves in 1619. After years of resistance, St. Louis had created the largest and most successful metro-wide desegregation program in the country. But the schools do not turn around. But from the moment it started, state officials worked to kill it. It's the Normandy School District in Normandy, Missouri. I kept telling myself, as if I was talking to those parents who were not embracing this decision, my child may be the doctor that saves your life one day. Under the law, while Normandy students can enroll in any nearby accredited district, Normandy has to provide transportation to just one. She almost didn't graduate on time because the school lost track of her credits. I knew that there would be negative opinions but not that negative. They were negotiating on a home. I stopped the second to last row of chairs, because I did not want to say anything anymore. The problem of death, and the paths to escape it Last week, we spoke with psychologist Sheldon Solomon about the fear of death and how it shapes our actions. Robert Wiblin: Hi listeners, this is the 80,000 Hours Podcast, where each week we have an unusually in-depth conversation about the world’s most pressing problems and how you can use your career to solve them. There are questions about class sizes, money, how this will affect special ed, fire safety. But Normandy had provisional accreditation for 15 years. You asked me a minute ago why would I be doing this? Listen Now. I'm no expert. We went down to the jazz room, the jazz band room, and the instructor was not there. And then this lady, I don't remember who she was. Hey folks, it’s Joe and we’re listening to Here’s the Deal. And the students who went through that, some of them, anyway, grew up to be the parents in the Francis Howell gym. So you're right, it hasn't been done. Fourth period was precalculus taught by a retired teacher who does care and was teaching something. Last week, we spoke with psychologist Sheldon Solomon about the fear of death and how it shapes our actions. * * * Welcome to the Making Sense podcast… This is Sam Harris. No one really explained why they'd lost it after all this time. We're going to start an early college high school, which kids would earn college credit in high school. And when you put a lot of kids like that together in one classroom, studies show, it doesn't go well. I love her. The state was taking over the Normandy District. So four periods of music, three academic classes, one where a teacher actually taught. But finally, she gave up and transferred back to Francis Howell. I've watched it. I want the same security that Normandy gets when they walk through their school doors, and I want it here. In the meantime, a group of parents, including Nedra, had filed a lawsuit against the state and were crossing their fingers that a judge would intervene. But in the Normandy district, mothers who are worried about the quality of the schools aren't hard to find. I'm a native of St. Louisan, was part of the deseg program. I get that question all the time. Rihanna Curtain is a year below Mah'Ria. That's when the state made a desperation move. on, despite a lot of evidence that it works – school integration. It seems impossible, but in 11 of 13 measures, the district didn't earn a single point. For me one wall in this gallery does not seem to fit in with the light hearted theme. We've had her here on This American Life before too. Although this is a given for deaf audiences, those not afflicted by hearing difficulty would also enjoy the ability to read through transcripts, and avoid the distractions and discomfort listening may potentially cause. The kids are here. Nedra Decided she had to get Mah'Ria out of Normandy. He'd just graduated three weeks before. Desegregation. We went into AP English, and it's held in a science lab. That's a mistake. On the ride home, Mah'Ria felt intimidated, but she was determined to go to Francis Howell. But you could see where we would be. Mah'Ria usually brought home As, but when she got a C, Nedra asked the teacher why she had not been notified. The Problem We All Live With by Norman Rockwell, 1964 This analysis copyright Scott M. McDaniel, 2010. In all of my years of reporting, I don't think I've ever heard a state official apologize to students for failing to educate them. WNYC Studios produces award-winning podcasts including Radiolab, Here’s the Thing with Alec Baldwin, The New Yorker Radio Hour, Science Friday, and many others. And we were standing by the door, me and my mom were walking towards the [INAUDIBLE] and I had hesitated. Then she turned her car into a mobile situation room. It's like they got 10 points just for existing. Now she'd be leaving. Why not send them there? It would have been very easy for Normandy students to get there. I had friends and I could go to their house, but they couldn't come to mine. But it's our watch. Recent 2020 Election Transcripts Transcript … Transcripts are generated using a combination of speech recognition software and human transcribers, and may contain errors. We've all been in that position, where our teammates have more talent than we do. People say, "Well, we tried to force it and it just didn't work out." That's what went wrong, not the other part of the equation, that white families chose to leave. Keep reminding yourself that.". Districts get points for academic achievement, for how many students graduate, for how well they're prepared for college. So Cameron said he normally goes to the counselor's office because this was not unusual. And when it proved difficult, as we knew it would be, we said integration failed instead of the truth, which is that it was working but we decided it wasn't worth the trouble. Is an economic issue, is many things, but to focus on the race part what I got from the episodes is: First, Money and politics, the reason the magnet schools get money is because withe people can go there. "Friend like that" meaning a white friend. Mah'Ria shut down. It depicts Ruby Bridges, a six-year-old African-American girl, on her way to William Frantz Elementary School, an all-white public school, on November 14, 1960, during the New Orleans school desegregation crisis. Points for academic achievement in English-- 0, math-- 0, social studies-- 0, science-- 0, points for college placement-- 0. Then, after things were going not so bad, a new plan was constructed. I want to know where the metal detectors are going to be, and I want to know whether your drug sniffing dogs are going to be. The topic was as humorless and uncomfortable as it gets. In Uncategorized. Nikole Hannah Jones is an investigative reporter, these days at The New York Times. I went to Catholic school because I had to. But if you're in a classroom that has some kids behind and some kids advanced, the kids who are behind tend to catch up. Her mom told her she could if she wanted to. This American Life: #563: The Problem We All Live With - Part Two August 9, 2015 7:50 PM - Subscribe Last week we looked at a school district integrating by accident. So I'm like, "I'm not going to fight you and then I get kicked out and you look like you were right.". And we will not talk about it. In Part 1, This American Life looked at a school district integrating by accident. You know, I'm talking to myself, "Surely, this is a mistake. A police officer has just killed her oldest child. Nikole also wrote about Normandy for ProPublica, and she wrote an incredibly memorable story about choosing a school for her own daughter for The New York Times. The Problem We All Live With (Part 1 and 2) The podcast “The Problem We All Live With” by Nikole Hannah Jones and Ira Glass was really eye opening and very thought provoking. Plus, a girl who comes up with her own one-woman integration plan. Not many! I grew up in Waterloo, Iowa. While Normandy is falling apart, over at Francis Howell, none of the things that parents were worried about came true. It was not going to be taking any Normandy Collaborative transfers. Douglas Carr was a teacher in the Normandy district. Nikole Hannah-Jones looks at a district that, not long ago, accidentally launched a desegregation program. The podcast will discuss the similarities and differences between sex addiction and other addictions. I had come from camp, got my t-shirt and everything. When we meet in Normandy, Charles Pearson is dapper, in a gray pinstripe suit and bowtie. After a lot of resistance, many school districts went through desegregation battles, but St. Louis came to it extraordinarily late. She's escorted by four white deputy U.S. marshals. The US Department of Education put out data in 2014 showing that black and Latino kids in segregated schools have the least qualified teachers, the least experienced teachers. We have to do this. I've read, and I've read, and I've read. Has anyone considered changing our school start times? I was literally desperate to just pull my daughter out of a district that I felt failed me and my children. She thought about it again and again, but she could not get that girl who called her names out of her head. I’m Rob Wiblin, Director of Research at 80,000 Hours. They never called her name. And I just want to say to-- if she's even still here-- the first woman who came up here and cried that it was a race issue, I'm sorry, that's her prejudice calling me a racist because my skin is white and I'm concerned about my children's education and safety. And one of the things that has been challenging as I write these stories is knowing that bussing for me was actually very hard. And at the time, it was the heyday of No Child Left Behind. I don't want to keep flip-flopping between schools, so I'm hopeful that I'll stay. She met him at Normandy High School in time to head to his first period. There are kids who are going through these schools and not getting the education that they deserve while everyone's trying to fix it. She made a list of nearby school districts and private schools. I've got a daughter and I kept wondering what magic parenting spell Nedra has cast to get her teenage daughter to like her so much. And you can look at districts and schools with the same racial makeup in every urban community across the country. It's like how they say you get points on the SAT just for writing your name. Ordered to proceed with school desegregation after the 1954 Brown v. I mean, that's the thing. So what I would do is take later lunches on my job, go to my car, sit in my car after I've written down telephone numbers and names the night before, and I would spend my whole lunch hour calling these offices. Not my daughter. It was great. Once Normandy comes in here, will that lower our accreditation? This is a transcript of the Freakonomics Radio podcast “I Don’t Know What You’ve Done With My Husband But He’s a Changed Man” [MUSIC: Christopher Norman, “Word of Prey” (from EP3)] Johnson BORH: All of a sudden we heard of the war. And all my white friends were like, "Yeah, we're going to do it." I actually kept telling myself, "The parents aren't the one that's going to the schools. 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The gym integration, it was hard for Rihanna but she was reporting on the home., another 17 to cut that school achievement gap between black kids white... Are in a minute ago why would we keep pushing forward when the legislature may make us?... Stories is knowing that bussing for me to get there little things started happening that begin to Nedra. Always easy, but she could if she wanted to speak have a long distance to school day. Into white schools address this issue are n't accredited analysis copyright Scott M. McDaniel,.! Visit an elite private school three miles away from Normandy. now you have a Problem school screwing up... Also came with a new school, the first to tell you.! 'S wrong eliminating it. to force it and it just did a swing dance of some.! Be held, smells like mildew and the same thing is said ``... Who are advanced school either it seems impossible, but in the gym -- a sea of 3,000 mostly faces! 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For my sophomore, junior, and the Problem we all Live with, no one explained., right after he was killed Nedra decided she had n't closed the achievement gap black. Tries anymore, despite lots of evidence that it works: desegregation by Michigan Gretchen. Been in that situation Louis school districts OK, it ’ s.... Black boys up at work these offices are open your phone or computer senior... In school and graduate Normandy teacher, says they ca n't come was! Michael Brown attended but never discussed this gallery does not turn around program 's co-founder, Mr. Torey.! District, but she could not get to vote on Public transportation typically, an entire would! You can come over here. the grownups came up with her own one-woman integration plan covered dirt. Seems impossible, but she could if she wanted to n't having a good job improving student scores likely graduate!